i know this is probably a taboo subject with most of you and i will probably be accused of being a sex tourist .

i travelled to phuket in november 2005 alone , went to patong beach , devised my own itinery prior to departure which did not include visiting a barbeer . but , when i reached patong and decided to take a stroll down to the beach , i found that being alone was going to be too hard to bare , so that same evening i did something i promised myself i wouldnt do ,
i visited a bar in bangla road and invited one of the girls to spend the evening with me , the evening turned into eight days and we built a nice friendship . i have returned to england now , but we have stayed in contact .
i believe her , she told me i had been her first customer and her first encounter with a man , i feel guilty about .

i would like to know how other thais and farang feel about bargirls and i would like to know ( as with the girl i met ) , she did this once , she has now returned to chiang mai , will she be looked upon as " dirty " ??

Did she speak English and if so how well, and was it bar girl English? Or was it consistent with her having learnt it at college, if that is what she says?

I would have asked her:-

How long she had been working there at the bar. She may or may not tell you the truth, but you usually get some indication from how much she knows about things, inc farangs. If it really is just a short time, then that could be a good sign.

How long had she been in Phuket.
What she did before.
What is she doing now, back in Chaing Mai.
And think about how she funded herself during this period.

How do you keep in touch? If she is Internet literate and didn't learn it at school, I would be more worried. If she rings you, how does she afford the phone cards?

I would also look through the "Danger signs" list on this forum.

Good Luck

Bar girl or no bar girl, she's still a human being to be treated with respect and dignity.

She obviously enjoyed your company as I think she would have made excuses and moved on had she not.

All I can say is, be careful and take your time.

Gary

The girsl who work the bars are just people the long they stay the harder they become, remember as a norm we are just as honest with them as they are with us. A good book with a odd name is Hello My Big Big Honey, tells both sides of the story.

I remember the first girl I was with in Pattaya, a beautful girl and I told her that. She said you farrangs are all alike say all these things and you don't mean them, she was obviously at the time more experienced then I was.

If the girl was from Chaing Mia and returning home, he had a cover story not to include bars. You would be surprised how many Issan girls make 50k a month elling noodles in Bangkok. The village knows but the cover stories are usually excepted.

Mt Nephew married a bar girl from Pattaya took her to the states six years ago and they still have a good marriage. she had been in the bar for a year or more. Everything depends on the people nothing is etched in stone.

The fact is that it much easier for farrangs to meet bar girls because that is what they are there for and they usually speak some english.

If you keep things on a friendship basis you shouldn't have any problems. there is absolutely nothing wrong that, just have some fun and enjoy the company.

Mr Nicely, Galee and Ray have given you excellent advice and help. Bar girls are people and deserve to be treated as ladies if they act like a lady. If it was not for barmen there would be no bar girls. I actually know and I bet everyone else know also of a fine lady who is one of the worst B**chs you could ever find. Forget her past and move on to the future. Maybe you will find your life mate if not dwelling on the past to much.

By the way seems like you met someone you like as a friend. See what happens.

Please remember SLOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW is the word that keeps popping up everywhere.

yes youre right , thankyou for the advice

They used to say

" you can take a girl out of the bar but you will never get the bar out of the girl"

has anything changed?

And they still say you can take the man out of the bar but you can't take the bar out of the man.

If they both met there then IMHO it is the same. If you don't want a bar girl then don't go to bars. Still no guarantee.

By the way welcome TC.

i used to go to bars in england on a regular basis when i was in my twenties , most of my hard earned cash was spent around alcohol .
but i rarely go into a pub ( bar ) , i would rather have a few glasses of wine at home .
yes, when i was on holiday in thailand , i was socialising everynight .

so my answer to you banpaeng , yes you can take the bar out of the man .

i have learned an awful lot this past year .
i want to learn more about different cultures , i dont want to question peoples cultures without knowing something about them first.

Ok but do you think it is fair to meet a girl in a bar, then talk bad about her. I don't think so as you both came from the same setting. If you don't want to meet a bar girl then don't go to one to meet girls. Yes you can take the bar out of the girl. That is just a good defensive line to avoid a relationship when one might be possible. People are people male and female

And yes I know several ladies that have left the bar scene and become fine upstanding ladies. By the way that is Thai, Falang, etc.

Everyone deserves a chance to be good. It is the ones that dump on that chance that it does no good to help. Only thing is you are never sure when that person will come by. And they might not pass again.

In saying that, I know also of folks that were born with a golden spoon in their mouth and ended up in the streets(both male and female). I will venture to say you know some also because they are everywhere US, Europe, Asia Etc.

The point is you can't just lump everyone into one catagory, because they do one thing. Judge the whole package, then see how that affect you. Don't worry about what people say or do, judge for yourself. If you listen to others, you may pass up a gold mine.

Another thing is, if a falang is with an asian lady at least 75% of the folks will think she came from a bar anyway. This is in Thailand or the country of orgin. I've been living this a long time and I promise you they will. If you can not ignore their stupidity then leave asian women alone as it will happen. Been asked more than once or twice where I met my wife.

Even the governments have that attitude as I wanted my sister in law to come over and visit and bring wifes mother. Visa was denied due to to many had left Thailand to practice the trade. By the way sister in law is married three kids to a Thai man. US govt is prejudiced also. This is not second hand info as the folks at the embassy told me themselves. I was pissed and ask my Congressman when I got back and his investigation turned up the same thing. Did not help though.

As wife just told me, some times you do not have the ability to pick and choose what they do or where they are born.

Old saying: If you can't stand the heat don't , go in the kitchen!!

Banpaeng, having lived in Patong and Phuket for some years, whilst I would be the first to agree that you can't lump everyone in the same boat and that everyone is not the same, let me say the odds do tend to be stacked against you if you go looking in bars, particularly for a relative newbie.

When I was looking, I did find the odd nice girl working in a bar, usually one that hadn't been there long, didn't want to be there, and hadn't yet been indoctrinated by the others. But they were very difficult to find, and usually required the ability to speak some thai, as usually such girls hadn't yet learnt their bargirl English. Searching for a GF when I was in Patong became my project and it is fraught with risk. There are so many playing the same game, believe me, I knew many of them. And not just bar girls or freelancers!

More than once BG's themselves said to me, "--- why you look for GF in bars? Better you look in offices, shops, hotels and restaurants. Though in Patong, even that can be risky.

That would be my advice to anyone. - Look in the right places, not in bars, unless you have a lot of time, experience and money.

Interesting to note, in general the Thais don't refer to them as bar girls, but as "Mia Chow" rented wife!!!Maybe an indication of their attitude to them.

Arjay you are 100% correct but I noticed you talked and listened to them. the guys I am refering to are the ones that go looking there and then put them down. That is the reason for saying about heat and kitchen.

And Yes I have met some in Patpong, Nana and actually all over Thailand and some are really pro like. My point is why put them all down until you talk to them. It seems this is what you did(talk to them) and If I can be so bold as just say you had respect for them.

It is folks that won't talk but go to bars and then say there all bad and I would not go with them even though they just did.

I have reread this and I do not know how to express this over the net but I believe all are equal. In all professions there is good and bad. Talk to them and if bad walk away. If good be friends and if a relationship develops so be it but go slow.

As for the odds I agree, not in ones favor looking in bars, so why look there.

Mr Valintine, I agree with your statement also.

TC wrote:They used to say

" you can take a girl out of the bar but you will never get the bar out of the girl"

has anything changed?

Now TC you and I both know some things you don't want to take out of the BG (Just harrasing a friend)

How was the ride to Chaing Mia Tut Tut Jep Jep?