I am hoping Udongirl or Val can help answer this one.

I believe that Thai people's perception of status is strongly influenced by their perception of a person's wealth, - by displays of wealth, e.g. owning a big house, gold jewellery and expensive cars, and other visible displays of wealth such as flashing the cash.

My question is - is that how Thai people really judge us, - is that all they see? Or can they see through that. Does one's general behaviour and manners count for anything, or is it just perceived wealth??

For example, from time to time I see what I believe to be a low class farang, as in loud-mouthed, badly behaved, swearing in public, shouting at their TGF's etc, but maybe adorned with gold jewelery (or chains the size of toilet chains!) and generally flashing the cash. For ease of reference, I will call them, louts who flash the cash.

Another example/situation I recall from a long time ago, (not in Udon) was of a bar-girl who when describing her BF, said that he often gets drunk, he smokes too much, (apologies to smokers and drinkers) he shouts at her (bullies) and sometimes even threatens her, but he's a good man, because he gives her money every month and bought her a new motorbike!

Do Thai people see such people as Hi-So farangs simply because they have large and visible wallets, or can they see the real person??

Arjay, I don't think that status as defined by wealth is particular to Thailand. Westerners give status in the west to all sorts of trashy people simply because they are wealthy (or famous). Thais are not alone in this respect.

I've also wondered the same things.
When I go out in public, ie: Tesco, the mall, restaurants, gov't officices, etc., I believe I carry myself nicely, and behave politely. Long pants, shirts with collars or if a t-shirt, cleaned and ironed, close toed shoes, etc.
However, I don't see or feel myself being treated or viewed any differently than a "lout" dressed in old frayed shorts, tank top, flip-flops, and sporting a two-day growth of beard, etc.

Maybe (Issan) women believe they have less choices ie they are willing to put up with a lot more boorish, ignorant, or even trashy behaviour, than the equivalent woman in farang land would endure.

JJ, I am not sure what long pants, collared shirts, closed shoes and a freshly shaved face have to do with reasonable behaviour. There is a school of thought that "clothes maketh the man", but IMHO it is bullsh1t.

I am talking about Thai people here, not farangs in their home countries; nor how much Thais will put up with, because of what we have to offer etc.

Thais themselves are very status orientated and have a type of social hierarchy, I am keen to know how they assess/judge us, and if and how they position us in terms of status, one farang compared to another. (i.e. not as a group)......... Is it simply based on our perceived or displayed wealth,....... or can they see beyond that?

I understand they do find it quite difficult to assess/understand/judge us.

AJ in terms of status, I can only make one simple observation.

My TGF is the youngest of (previously 7, now) 6 children, ranging in age from approx 50 to 30.

I am (a little bit ) older than any of the siblings, or their respective spouses - and a lot better off financially However, when I asked her about my status/hierarchy in the family, she said that as I was her partner, I was at the bottom of the tree, with her.

Maybe this will change, maybe not. I don't give a f*ck, because in my own eyes, I know where I stand.

jackspratt wrote:AJ
Maybe this will change, maybe not. I don't give a f*ck, because in my own eyes, I know where I stand.

This is an opinion only.

First I must agree with Jack and say self respect is crucial. In other words I know who I am and the world be danm.

To get to Arjays question, I think the Thais opinion of falangs is quite low. Sure we have some resources that they will try to lighten the load for us, but that is how it is everywhere I have been. I look at it this way, we all have our prejudices and we are prejudged by the ones who have gone before. The tales of Pattaya and Bangkok precede us to the outer reaches of Thailand.

While I am in Thailand, one of the greatest compliments I can receive is

Guys, thanks for the input, but my question was, and still is:

"Thais themselves are very status orientated and have a type of social hierarchy, I am keen to know how they assess/judge us, ONE FARANG AS COMPARED TO ANOTHER) and if and how they position us in terms of status, one farang compared to another. (i.e. not as a group)......... Is it simply based on our perceived or displayed wealth,....... or can they see beyond that?"

I was asking how they assess us, individually - one as compared with another - not as a whole or a group. E.g. can they see the gold toilet chain for what it is? Does that overcome the stubbled face, singlet and beer stained shorts. Or to put it another way, can they differentiate between money and class?

I think Arjay's question was about status.

In my opinion, in Thailand one's status depends on who you know and who you are associated with.

> can they differentiate between money and class?

In my experience - no. We (farangs) are totally outside the thai social hierarchy, we are just farangs. And (to comment on one of your statements in the first post) we can not be hi-so because we're not thai, no matter how much money we have.

The Queen might be an exception...

I think that being a Falang automatically does give you a certain status with Thais.
However I have never had the pleasure of being in with the 'Hi/So' crowd so I am not sure exactly where that automatic status end.
But in my experience with the average Thai person if you act like a a complete pratt then that does not decrease your status but the Thai recognises you as a person of a highish status who just happens to be a complete pratt.
So, as far as where we are on the social hierarchy I think it is very much all the same as a general group. I guess if an individual Falang always displayed an extreme at either end of the scale (so was a tramp or was an multimillionaire) then their status might be adjusted to take account of that.
But, like you RJ, I would like to hear a Thai opinion on the question.

Lets try this another way.

I went on a tour to China with a group of 22 rich Thais ( a mix of Thai and Chinese/Thai). I was the only Falang. When we left Thailand, only one man spoke to me and when we sat down together for meals, my wife and I were not exactly welcome at any table. I was not to bothered by it, but you could tell it bothered some of the folks. I understood some of the comments said.

By the end of this week long trip, I was able to talk to anyone (with the exception of one couple), was invited to a couple of their houses. Do I for one minute think I was Thai? No way but at least I was tolorated. There is a long line between being accepted and tolorated. The one couple that I refer to as the exception was really pissed because when we left Thailand to fly to China, the wife and I received from the Thai Guide 2 upgraded tickets. She threw a fit then and let him know that she was Thai and Thais take care of Thais first. I feel sorry for her as this incident ruined her trip to china as she could not get over it and if her husband even said hi to me she lambasted him for talking to a Falang.

That is why I said above that you can work on your immediate surrondings and try to change the image, however for a one on one and you have not met before, the opinion is low of falangs. I know there are many fine falangs who live in Thailand, that is for sure. However there are a lot of louts also and add the sex tourist and what else are folks suppose to think.

The above is an opinion. Arjay, that is as best an answer to your question I have and an opinion on my part, as the group proceeds the individual.

I dont beleive this can be honestly answered

Thai's are not the same has a whole, just like any place else, people have their own oppion based on their own Experience and Culture of their family structure and so on,

i am sure i could be wrong, but IMHO people are just people, Thai's will not have the same oppion about Farangs, it all depends on what got them this far in life

Interesting thread

I agree with banpaeng, "group proceeds the individual"

How are we represented in the Thai media? Particularly TV

That would form/color a lot peoples opinions

thais call it jai dee if you have a good heart you will receive back two fold its not who you are but what you are.